Friday, June 8, 2018

Buying a Battery

maximum disc charge rate

Saturday, May 19, 2018

Why do electric cars need only one gear

3.14159265359 = π

Mt. Goat Cycletruck Gearing

Calculating a workable top speed for the cyclone motor below
800rpm ÷ 72v = 11.111111 x 48v = 533.33332 rpm at max throttle

This will be a slower speed because of the rolling resistnce etc.

Tuesday, April 17, 2018

Sprockets for heavy duty mid-mounted motors


Mt. Goat Cycletruck Gearing

1000 watts is produced by:
continuous 80 Nm at 120 rpm
(“spinning” in low gear)
continuous 159 Nm at 60 rpm
(“pedal mashing” in high gear)

Kinetic momentum relieves stress on the chain and sprocket. So if you can build up momentum before reaching the steepest part of the hill it can help you get past it. A motor will operate better at higher RPM in a lower gear with more momentum.

I simulated several hub-motors at 1300watts with correct gear reduction for climbing a 9% grade with 450lbs, (using a smaller wheel to simulate a gear reduction) to lower the amount of stress as much as possible. I got 46 to 51 lbs thrust (about 62- 69Nm). But climbing a steeper hill could produce up to 92lbs thrust (124 Newton-meters) on 20% grade.

Any motor that will produce as much as 130Nm (95.88 foot-pounds force) of torque really needs to not be driven through the cassette free-hub body, unless you want things to start breaking. So I will have to turn the motor around and drive the left side. Using a 750watt motor that can actually produce 1000w is just about as much as a bicycle drive train can handle. Even if you do use a BMX single speed chain. And if you use the same drive-train to stand on the pedals, look out!

#41 chain can be used on the left side with a single speed only. That is all you really need with a Cyclone 3000 especial if your single gear is set low enough to climb your worst hills at close to half power; with your average worst total-combined-weights, to keep the motor from over heating).

They also have sprocket for the 410 bicycle single speed chain.

 Don't think that spending a lot of money on a light weight, high-tech bicycle sprockets like the computer designed chain and sprockets, it is not going to help much. 1/8
th inch wide sprockets and chain will make a much stronger drive-train. But a #41 chain and sprocket will out last any bicycle equipment no matter how expensive it is.

And It's important to line up the rear sprocket with the chainring if you don't have a derailleur to reconcile them. Sram's new derailleurs are designed to be used with much larger than the usual 34t mega range sprockets (“cogs” for bicycle mechanics). But if you want to build a truly “heavy duty” cycle truck, forget the bicycle equipment!

Two gears would be much better than one. But that would require a single chain that can shift.
If you can find a way to have the Shimano cassette spline cut into the center of a BMX chain-wheel, you should do that. BMX chain-wheels are typically made for 1/8" chains, and are available up to 10mm thick at the center hole. The hard part is going to be finding somebody who has the very expensive single-purpose cutting tool (spline broach) that allows a machinist to put the correct splines in a round hole.

If this motor puts out 400 rpm at about 1300watts a 60t sprocket on the rear with a 32t on the motor will give me a speed close enough to what I need for the target of 13mph for 450lbs on a 9%grade (This is why the e-bike laws must change). And with so much power at my disposal and enough copper in the motor to deal with any wasted energy as heat; I won't need to worry about getting the gear reduction exactly right.

Chain Selection and Sizing for Mid Drive Applications:
Larger roller pins, both in diameter and width, will provide a greater surface area to purchase on the valleys of the teeth of a sprocket or chain ring. It would make sense that an 1/8" chain should be able to provide more purchase and handle more power without failing prematurely. However 1/8" chain does not have and ramps on the plates and are not suited for moving from cog to cog like a geared system. A smaller tooth count chainring or sprocket tends to wear faster than a larger one.”

Better chains
Wipperman Connex 7R8. It's a 3/32" BUSHING-type chain, May be high priced for a good reason: Wipperman appears to be the only manufacturer that is producing a 3/32" bushing chain anymore; probably because the buying public is used to the availability of "bushingless" chains, which shift better on a derailleur drivetrain, and are WAY cheaper to manufacture. A bushing-type chain will GREATLY extend your drivetrain life, since load is distributed over far more surface area. The 7R8 is single-chainline specific, so there is absolute minimal lateral play. Just make sure your chainline is DEAD straight.

Single speed chains, not for shifting:
The KMC Z chains (with an H in the model number) also come in both sizes rate at 2640 ft-lbs Z510HX Wide 1/8” and Z610HX Narrow 3/32” or Z1HX Narrow 3/32” heavy duty chains.

Most mechanics agree that you should replace your chain about every 2,000 to 3,000 miles so if you can build or buy a full coverage chain guard then convert to a belt drive you may possibly have a truly long lasting drive-train. 3Dprinted belt drive pulley?

It is no wonder that people would rather use a hub motor, even if it does use much more battery power. I recommend a 2500watt 5:1 geared hub motor!!! Even if you need to strengthen your frame some how.

And then there is the tire issue; I would build the frame wider in the rear so I could use a 3” to 4” inch wide motorcycle tire, on a 16” motorcycle rim. With a 2.25” x 16” in the front.

single speed free wheel on adapter for motor shaft

I don't think this will work with a large sprocket

The only way to keep your chain clean

Sunday, March 18, 2018

Cyclone Planitery Gear Reduction Motor

The base of the Cyclone uses a planetary gear reduction, so that the motor turns much faster than it would without it…and what this does is allow it to make a lot of power-to-weight, and improves efficiency.

Some one said you can't get 3000watts out of it unless you use a 72volt battery. But that is way too much power any how. 

I do recommend this motor kit for a heavy duty utility cycletruck. Buy the new more expensive brackets and other upgrades. And the 32 sprocket third chainring is essential for serious hill climbing with cargo like children or bricks. And they are working on finding smaller chain rings for really mean hill climbing.

I intend to program the controller to about half the maximum power possible (1300 watts output; 1600w input), unless I have to haul bricks up a really badly steep hill.

At 600 RPM the 32 sprocket chainring back to my 34 sprocket cassette will slow me down to about 14mph using my 23 inch drive tire. That is good for ironically steep hills.

I am going to use only two speeds with this drive, and possibly only one speed. I will remove my rear derailleur, and use a stronger BMX chain that is not flexible enough (side to side) for gear shifting.

Motors with Planetary gear reductions
There are several motors with planetary gear reductions built in so that you don't have to build an external gear reduction. The cyclone 3000watt is actually a 2500watt motor capable of 3000w under the right conditions. I needed only 1300w so I will program the controller to limit the power output.

Most people need only 1000w for our steep hills. So they can use the BBS03. It will be easier to apply to the bicycle than the cyclone kit. And the battery pack will not need to be so big.

Wiring Diagram:

Full Data:


Max speed 900RPM (unloaded at the output shaft)
  • Rated speed 800 RPM
  • Rated output 3000W (72V @ 40a)
  • Max output 4000W
  • Rated Torque 50Nm
  • Max Torque 100Nm
  • Rated Amp 40A
The chain rings and sprocket can take any bike chain. So the best if you do not change the freewheel and chain-rings is the KMC single speed chain.
For the ebrake cutoff switch:
It's a magnet and reed switch so it should work with any lever (some glue or bracket may be needed). Please be aware that the ASI controller do not have a brake sensor input or a pedal assist sensor input. Only the 40amp stock controller has these inputs.
The best direct drive hub-motors overheat long before the BBS02 does on the same climbs. So this one will be much better at half power. If you need more than 1300w output you are moving too fast! Or you are about to pop your drive chain.
52v Panasonic Ebike Pack 25ah (lunacycles)

How to program this motor controller:

24 sprocket third chainring for serious hill climbing

If you are having jumpy throttles, I suggest upgrading to a proper programmable controller that you can tweak the battery and phase amps ratio to something that starts smooth when you throttle up. this will save your gear box and bike drivetrain from having issues due to the tremendous amount of torque this kit has. Most probably the stock controller are configured for direct drive hub motor which requires a higher battery to phase amps ratio to turn that massive bicycle wheel without any reduction. In a mid drive you really don't need that as you already have all that reduction and the motor spinning easily from standstill.

Thursday, February 1, 2018

Motorized Retro Direct Drivde

Two motors and Two gear speed gear box?

A heavy human powered vehicle (HPV) that can drive 450lbs total combined weight up the steep hills in Vancouver will need at least two gears to climb the steep hills with a legal wattage. Read more: cycle tractor.

With 7500 rpm output for maximum momentum efficiency using a high voltage motor, you will need a lot more gear reduction (like 13:1 total) to keep it down to about 11-13mph [17-21kmh] on a 9% to 10% grade but even that would be quite a fast gear with Canadian legal power.

So two motors would be needed. Making the vehicle illegal only when you need to turn on the second motor. But it will still not be able to drive faster than the speed limit if the gears are low enough. About 16mph [26kmh] on flat land.

A retro-direct drive is a fast (high gear) in the forward direction and a slow (low gear) in the reverse.

Making a switch to reverse the motor: (see the middle of page 5): Epicyclic retro-direct 2 speed transmission.

There’s a problem with the design of planetary gears – there is inherent backlash and play between the gears. There can be problems with binding or jamming. It would be better if the prototype was made without planetary gears.

A hypocycloid gear could be a better way of gearing down but without tight fitting gears you can have the same problem. A harmonic drive would be much better if you could design one to do this retro-direct switching.

The ring gear is attached to the output
 shaft and the planet gears are stationary 
on a plate with a one-way bearing
 in the opposite direction.

more here 

Friday, January 12, 2018

Motors for Pedicab Rickshaws

Front seated rickshaw pedicabs are so much easier to motorize than the kind with the seats in the rear. Applying the motor to the single rear drive wheel is like motorizing a bicycle.

There are advantages to using a single gear reduction with a belt drive, that will move only 10 to 13mph on your worst hills. Even with two motors operating at once you will never be able to drive faster than the legal speed limit for such a vehicle. A high voltage, low amp controller with high RPM gear reduction is much easier on the motor by wasting less energy as heat.

You will have plenty of torque thrust starting across busy intersections. And you don't need motors running on vertualy flat land. Muscle power should be used for easy terrain.

But with 800lbs you will need some fabulous double pad hydraulic disc brakes. Or you could find out the hard way what happens.

If you want to go slow without a gear reduction and pull heavy loads get the CRYASTLYTE X5306 and it will move along at 2-3 mph and pulls like a mule. But gear reductions are more efficient, and easier to fit into a legal frame work if the idiot law makers would understand that gear reductions can be made to stay under the speed limit with out electronics. Which would result in the impossibility of some wise guy making a hot rod out the vehicle.

Due to people ignoring the e-bike laws and the complete lack of understanding about how powered bikes should be built electric-assist pedicabs were banned in New York City in January 2008, along with all other forms of electric vehicles; the city council decided to allow pedicabs propelled only by muscle power. The city of Toronto Canada decided not to issue permits to electric-assist pedicabs.

If you want to use as much power as it takes to move 800lbs up a steep hill in the U.S. you must get a computer-simulation done to prove the safety of your vehicle. And that costs many thousands of dollars.

So it is not likely that rickshaws will ever become popular in the land of milk and honey. Until there is no more petroleum left.

Power at the wheel needs to be 1497W to go up a 9% grade at 14mph carrying 600lbs, 1294W to go 12mph. When we have only 400lbs, we are at 859W for 12mph, and 994W for 14mph. This all assumes you are already traveling at those speeds before you hit the hill.

Had Oregon law been more like Ontario law, which states that the motor has to have continuous output power of 500W, you could get around it by having much higher peak loads for short periods. Talk to a state congressman and get them to change the law so it states "continuous output power". Giving you the room for peak bursts up hills.
To move a heavy vehicle up a steep grade slowly the motor needs a lot of copper winding to handle the energy wasted as heat. Or you can use a faster higher voltage and less amperage to achieve the same wattage at a more efficient RPM. But of course you will need a larger gear reduction. So most people end up using an over-sized motor that will waste energy and run the risk of conflict with the laws. 

Gears do not waste energy, they convert torque RPM into thrust, and increase efficiency by using more momentum

Recommended Motor for Pedicab?

Monday, August 7, 2017

Take Action NOW, Before it is too late!
If you really want to find a way to live without a car, start taking notes about what you carry, how far and how steep your hills are. You might be able to live with an electric bicycle as a second vehicle a lot easier than only a bicycle, even with a motor. I would rather pay for an electric bicycle that can handle much more total combined weight than I will ever carry, on hills that can be avoided most of the time, than to find out a few years down the road that I put too much stress on the power-system too often. Electric bicycles can be built to last twenty years or more. But most factory parts will not last even half that long.

After a few months of taking notes you could take an educated chance at living without a car for a while. I know a magazine editor that did it for a month or so. But he learned that it was impossible to maintain a American family without a car. And that their car cost them around a thousand dollars a month (over the total life span of the vehicle) in the 1990's. And that was in our SMALL town!

450Lbs total combined weight is easy to achieve. The average American weighs 200lb +100lb for the bike, leaves 150lb cargo. But most bicycles can't handle even that much extra weight. How much do you think children weigh? 350Lb total combined weight is easier to motorize.

I know people that are rich enough to own an electric bicycle and still not use it except for good weather joy riding and to run a few errands. My knees are so worn-out from arthritis that I may never be able to ride without a motor again. And I have no car, nor can I even think about paying for the maintenance and insurance of one.

If only 1% of the world's population can think "outside the box". The rest are firmly stuck within the box, so writing this blog maybe a waste of time unless someone is willing to learn to think outside of the box. You can start by not standing in straight cue lines at the stores. There is an insane psychology of how people stand in lines. I usually try to keep the lines from blocking the isle by turning it, but people get nervous and act like someone is going to steel their place in line. This insanity also shows up as 'bumper-to-bumper' driving. I don't think I can stand it much longer!!

Alt-right's hidden agenda:

Saturday, August 5, 2017

Mileage Comparison

Miles per gallon comparison of vehicles, to electric bicycles. Locally produced energy gives better mileage.